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Bob - 2005-08-13 11:50:12
Sorry to hear that you'll be less of a bloggobblin... but at least you're making hay today. I too enjoyed "Third Rock" whenever I watched it. But oddly, whereas I made a point of watching "News Radio" when it was on, other shows such as that with a somehow similar ensemble vibe, like "That Seventies Show", and "The Simpsons"?, and even, to a lesser extent, "Less Than Perfect", I've never made a point of watching, unless I run into them. ...Even though I enjoy them. Don't know why that is;; maybe it's as simple as scheduling.
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Tom Ronca - 2005-08-13 13:05:49
'Primer' is a film I've consistently recommended to people this past year; It was on my 10 best list (which I never got around to writing up and emailing). It struck me as being a very literary bit of science fiction, much more concerned with people's reactions to the situation they're in (a unique and sometimes mind-boggling situation in this case) than gadgets and visual candy, as most cinematic scif-fi tends to be. Worth watching, several times in fact, if only to try and figure out what the hell's going on. As for '3rd Rock From the Sun' -- ahh, well, I think I'd sooner watch an episode of 'Lexx'. Happy to hear you got a better job, sad to hear that means you'll be bloggin' less.
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Alan - 2005-08-13 14:48:25
Hopefully this is just the first step in your plan for taking over the company and redirecting it's focus into cool Indie bands with monkey-themed names (or actual musically inclined monkeys, how cool would that be?). "Buckets of chimps, Buckets of lemurs"
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2fs - 2005-08-14 11:55:09
I'm not quite sure I follow your ideas about "self-esteem." True, it tends to get emphasized in a Hallmark cards version that evaporates any depth or thought...but I think it's still reasonable to say that one reason people may make poor decisions is that they can't imagine anything better for themselves, think they don't deserve anything better, or try to derive value from things that will help them little but are more valuable to others (like, say, teens who are promiscuous because they think it'll make people "like" them better). You ask, "what happens when you behave in ways that are self-supporting and positive? Do you suddenly have 'high self esteem'? How do you measure it? Where do you keep it?" I'm not sure why you say "suddenly" - who says such changes have to be sudden? And, like any other state of mind, you "measure" such things partly by results, by perception, etc. It's probably more visible to oneself when there are changes - i.e., "I used to act in self-destructive ways because I didn't think I mattered all that much; now I realize that's not true" - but asking "how do you measure it? where do you keep it?" is unanswerable, in a literal sense, of any psychological state...which doesn't mean they don't exist. You then ask, "Could it be that there are just behaviors and consequences, behaviors and consequences, and they don't fit into any pattern at all?" It could be, yes...but most people are at least moderately self-reflective, and if they realize that Behavior X tends to lead to Negative Consequence Y, they will back off on Behavior X. I suppose you could argue that what we call "low self-esteem" is really just a lack of self-reflection...except that it's pretty typical that someone is there telling the low self-esteem poster child that hey, when you act like that, bad things happen - so it'd be less lack of self-reflection than complete boneheadedness... But like I said: I'm not sure I follow what you do mean here.
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Paula - 2005-08-14 12:30:44
When I say "suddenly" I'm not talking about people changing, I'm talking about simultaneous behavior and the prism through which we see it.
Say our friend Werner has always had crappy jobs and he attributes it to "low self esteem," but he also is a reliable friend, takes good care of his health, and is a caring husband--where is his low self esteem now? Is his self esteem lower or higher than someone who has bad relationships, is successful at work, and a pretty good friend? How do you measure that?
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Paula again - 2005-08-14 12:51:39
bloggobblin: ha!! That's a good'un, Bob!
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Joe - 2005-08-14 15:45:58
Second kudos to NEWSRADIO. I got Seasons 1 & 2 on DVD and promptly wolfed down almost all of it. Speaking of wolfing down, I'm a regular at a local burrito place, and it *does* feel good!
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2fs - 2005-08-15 00:29:45
"How do you measure that?" I dunno - how do you measure happiness, or sadness, or sorrow, or pain? In your "Werner" example, he might be using "low self-esteem" as an excuse for his crappy jobs...but that doesn't invalidate the whole concept. Anyway, it's entirely possible for someone to be confident in many areas of their life (friendship, health, relationships) and not in others (jobs). Still, though, I'm with you insofar as "self-esteem" is such a buzzword & cliche that it's hard to actually see it for what it is. Call it something else, maybe. (Like whoever used the word "depression" in relation to clinical depression did the world a huge disservice, in allowing everyone to confuse garden-variety, circumstantial depression from the clinical variety, which may have no apparent cause.)
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Baby Party - 2005-08-15 10:51:06
I also have noticed a tendency in recent years for some people to correlate certain behaviors with "low-self esteem" - even in children - to an absurd degree. I haven't given it the thought that Paula or 2fs have, but I do have an anecdote to share. Years ago, I went on a date with a guy who happened to have written a book about enneagrams (which I always found a little silly, but that's another issue). Anyway, in the course of the dinner chit-chat, I made a mildly self-deprecating remark, intended to be humorous - I don't remember what it was about - perhaps something I'd forgotten to do, and I sort of joked about being forgetful - and he said, very seriously, "it sounds like you have low self-esteem." I decided then and there that there wouldn't be a second date. He did not have a nuanced enough worldview to see that there is a difference between having humility and being able to laugh at oneself, and having self-loathing. Also, he seemed to enjoy going around diagnosing people's low self-esteem. I also think it's too tempting for some folks to label folks who engage in behaviors they happen to disapprove of as having "low self-esteem." It's a backdoor way of judging them. "Well, of course he smokes pot - he has low self-esteem!"
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Paula - 2005-08-15 11:42:43
It's a backdoor way of judging them
Yes! And when we do that to ourselves, it's even more insidious.
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